front squats

[Tobes]

This evening, I experimented with front squats. I had recently read an article by Mike Boyle who said that front squats were "impossible to do wrong" and I'll be darned if he wasn't right.
For some reason, I think it's flexibility or mobility issues, I have a really hard time getting to parallel in the back squat. I can't seem to do it to save my life.
But when I tried front squats tonight, the sitting movement felt a lot more natural and if I didn't get to parallel, I got a lot closer than I do when I do a normal back squat.
Has anyone else ever found that beginners can go deeper in a front squat? Is there something about the position of the bar that makes it easier to do the movement properly? If I keep doing front squats, deep and with good form, could that help me eventually develop the ability to do a proper back squat?

[Scott Shetler]

It is much easier to keep an upright torso in the front squat because the weight is positioned on the front of the body, if you lean forward you are in danger of losing the barbell, whereas in the back squat you have to lean forward slightly to keep the bar in the rack, depending on how high you carry the bar. People that favor a narrower back squat stance tend to carry the bar higher on the upper back, people that use a wider "power" stance tend to carry the bar lower on the upper back/delts. The lower the bar is carried on the upper back the more the lifter will tend to lean forward, not too big of an issue as long as the lower back is locked into a tight arch and the lean isn't excessive. As far as front squats carrying over to back squats maybe, however the mechanics of the two variations are different. I think it is good to keep both front and back squats in your tool box as they are both great lifts. Back squats will lend themselves to heavier loads though.

-Scott

[Marc]

Something I noticed about front squats is that they appear to put less stress on my lower back. I am recovering from a minor back injury and I haven't been experiencing any discomfort from front squats. Is this due to the nature of front squats or is it because I still need work on by back squatting form?

[JeffD]

I think there is much to the notion that front squats almost force you to be safe, otherwise you'll dump the bar. I know some people like to work abs by doing squats without a belt. In my opinion, beltless front squats make more sense because they are safer and still force you to clamp down hard in the gut.
One of my favorites these days is to do 5x5 beltless front squats cleaning the bar, rather than doing them in the rack, and doing each rep as explosively as possible with about 80%-90% of what I can clean. Then maybe the next week I'll go heavier in the rack.

The thing I see that keeps people from front squatting is learning how to comfortably rack the bar. I think that just about anyone can gain the flexibility and skill to do this if you stick with it for a couple of months.

[danimal]

My new training partner has some phenomenal strength in the front squat, probably a max that is 80% of the back-squat, and this is as a relatively new lifter.

I feel that I am a little weak in the front squat, since my best is only 65% of my best back-squat, and it is totally an issue of racking the bar correctly. If I clean the bar from the floor, I have a better shot of being comfortable, compared to taking the bar from pins. But I will start focusing on front squats and overhead lifts in the wake of this last competition, and hopefully I will see some carryover in the deadlift.

-dan

[JeffD]

Danimal,

Don't let me give the impression that I'm stalking you around internet lifting boards, even if it happens to be true.

I think your friend's 80% is kind of surprising for a new lifter. My 1RM front squat to belt-only back squat ratio is now .76, and climbed quickly after handling heavy weights in front became more and more natural. With your flexibility and depth in a narrow squat, you should have a killer front squat once you get that weight nicely racked. Dana Nichols probably has a ratio of about .75-.80 now, and is getting better on the front squat every week.

I think front squats are an underappreciated lift, mostly associated only with Oly lifters. Well, I guess you occasionally see bodybuilders doing the version with hands crossed sometimes. Still, I think many more people would increase their
flexibility, quad strength, core strength, and explosiveness by doing them.

Jeff

[danimal]

I need to get back to the narrow squat. I made a lot of progress in those.

The front squat, I tend to put my feet out wider than normal, just to make room for my hips. It's kind of tough to stay upright with a narrow stance.

-dan

[Bobcat]

I used front squats as a kind of "advanced rehab" after an auto accident some years back. The exercise really does demand good form--"or else"--and it limited my hunger for more pounds while squatting. With short arms, racking the bar was a painful problem. Back then, I wrapped my wrists tightly and stuck to low reps.

I have since, at Ron's (Old Olympic Lifter's) suggestion, done some hands-free front squatting. While looking at some of my old issues of Milo, I was reminded that these have been dubbed "J.V. squats," after the late J. V. Askem. They solve the short-arm wrist pain problem, and make even greater form demands than more typical front squats, especially when walking them out.

[Marty]

I suspect you might have hip flexor flexibility issues or perhaps a psychological aversion to 'letting go' - I have seen this problem repeatedly in students learning front and back squats - perservere as this is a magnificent exercise...are you sure you are going light enough?

[Tobes]

I suspect you might have hip flexor flexibility issues or perhaps a psychological aversion to 'letting go' - I have seen this problem repeatedly in students learning front and back squats - perservere as this is a magnificent exercise...are you sure you are going light enough?

Marty, I've tried them holding a broomstick behind my neck. I could almost get to parallel, but not quite.

[Marty]

what we do is have the person grab onto a doorway or power rack and lower themselves - having a handhold allows the person to overcome their aversion to 'letting go' at parallel - so often a person will be unable to lower past a certain point yet by using the handhold for a period of time (training wheels) they are able to attain the bottom position and over time by arising using the handhold from the lowered postition they develop strength in a range they've never worked in before...it took one lifter almost two months to overcome their subconcious "brakes."

[John Prink]

If I keep doing front squats, deep and with good form, could that help me eventually develop the ability to do a proper back squat?[/QUOTE]

I think its possible. I'm a better front squatter than a back squatter - as far as style and form go. As far as poundages go I'm much better at back squatting in that respect.

While I think its a good idea to use a broomstick to learn a movement, I really think that one should try adding "some" weight to the bar or else its difficult to duplicate the movement properly. I find I need a little weight on the bar.....even some 25's would work fine....just to give a little resistance.

I also noticed that the crossed-arm bodybuilder style seems to put me in a difficult position to squat in, while the standard Olympic style is much easier for me.....albeit a little rough on the wrists at first.

[Marty]

I am trying to front squat using a heavy strap wrapped around the bar to 'extend' my grip - I can no longer front squat using the classical hand position and the bodybuilder cross-hand position does not work in the slightest for me - Brad Gillingham devised a way for those with poor wrist flexibilty to use lifting straps to extend the grip and I am trying something similar - I need a few more sessions before I relate the specifics...

[JimmyVengeance]

I await Marty's report eagerly. I've started working in front squats with greater frequency, and I like them -- I can't handle remotely heavy poundage yet, but they just feel like a great lift. They're damn hard in all the right ways.

At the moment, my wrists are flexible enough to steady the weight on my delts, but that's not always going to be the case. During times of seasonal busy-ness, my job requires that I do 250,000 or so keypresses a day (I'm a transcriptionist). While I've gotten pretty adept at staving off wrist tendonitis, a quarter million reps a day of anything is still a strain. I'd love to be able to take the pressure off the wrists during these times.

[Marty]

you know what - just get damned good at back squats and forget the front squats - seriously - I haven't been able to do FS consistently for over 20-years and because of your occupation - maybe you can't and shouldn't either...let them go - your spending way too much time worrying about doing this exercise and the time spent talking and fretting could better be spent back squatting...

[Lee Pinac]

Be careful with those wrists. Any extra stress in a fragile area can be seen as too much stress by your body and can lead to tendonitis. I'm with Marty, you don't want to mess up your livelihood.

Lee Pinac